Unai Emery: Adios

[Beksl]

What hyperbole may I ask you? Nonsense.

Your argument about blind faith and 2 year plan sounds really cool, but watch him fail next year and then you will realize he siphoned two years of our players contracts away.

Hyperbole as in lets sack a guy in his first season taking over from a Club legend of 22 years because we're in a bad patch of results.

Who would you rather see at the helm then? Who in your opinion would do a better job and why?

 

[14Henry]

Also, who the **** ever mentioned we need to win the league with this team? Comfortable top 4 was realistic and thats what we should judge Emery on. Failed spectacularly. But sure whatever you can come up with to defend this fraud.

I don't think top 4 was that realistic at the start of the season. Yes the last few months it was a possibility and one we didn't take.

However that blame doesn't lie just at Emerys door.

Is it his fault xhaka gave away a penalty? Which lost us 2 points.

Or was it his fault AMN made two stupid fouls against Leicester?

Was it his fault Mustafi gave away penalties and made mistakes.

Was it his fault to that he let Auba hit the penalty against Sp**s and not run on and take it himself.

Everyone wants to point the finger at one person and the easiest person is the manager.

However why not look at the players that are playing for the shirt and the fans who simply aren't good enough and due to injuries and emery only having one transfer window there's nothing we can do about it.

The team he put out yesterday was more or less full team. Those players should have been good enough to beat Brighton but they didn't. Which means as a club and establishment we weren't good enough for top 4. Simple.

 

[freeglennhelder2]

It would be good to know the average age of the “Emery out after one season” band. Suspect at its core-base is younger fans. Personally I blame this attitude on Snapchat, Instagram, filters, selfies, likes, and mumble rap

You’ve got to work hard to succeed people, it’s not just handed to you by a waiter in VIP bottle service in Hakassan.

 

[celestis]

Was not a fan of the triple sub while Brighton were right under the kosh yesterday in what was easily out most sustained period of effective attacking. Lost momentum for about ten minutes. Easy to talk in hindsight but I was screaming at the TV that it would happen when they were coming on. Fairly sure the neighbours heard me.

It's true though , we were really building pressure and the 3 subs which were too many at once just threw the momentum . After that everyone int the stadium all knew what was going to happen get it to Alex cross rinse repeat

 

[Tir Na Nog]

It would be good to know the average age of the “Emery out after one season” band. Suspect at its core-base is younger fans. Personally I blame this attitude on Snapchat, Instagram, filters, selfies, likes, and mumble rap

You’ve got to work hard to succeed people, it’s not just handed to you by a waiter in VIP bottle service in Hakassan.

I personally blame mumble rap for all of lifes woes.

 

[Camron]

I personally blame mumble rap for all of lifes woes.

What is mumble rap?

I know I could Google but I want to get to know my fellow posters.

 

[stiiphunn]

Firstly thanks for the sensibse reply. Yes I am a big anti Emery individual, mainly because:

1. Our results are not there. Especially against the weaker teams that we should win. If the goal is to get back to the champions league money, he did a very poor job tactically most of those games.

2. Poor man management. He is known for not handling the PSG situation well, and hasn't really inspired the team holistically here. I don't see the fight, the constant fire and desire that was taunted. Emery fans will jump on the players, but it is the managers job to glue it all into the field.

3. He has been very dire with the football that he plays. It is predictable, it is suboptimal and it is plain boring to watch.

All in all he is not a man I would like to see in charge of Arsenal because I pride this club to be challenging for the title. It doesn't feel like Emery has even instilled a foundation for a team that could do so. It feels like he does not know what this team will be set up week in week out.

He is not the right person to be here for another 10 years. So why waste two years on him?

Your argument with Klopp and Guardiola do not hold because there are many counter examples. It is also cherry picked to fit into your argument to give Emery more time.

It doesn't take two years to build a team that will not collapse to crystal palace or Leicester the way Emery did.

Thanks. And that's fair enough about Emery. If you don't think he's a good coach, then I'm happy to disagree about this. It is highly subjective, anyway. The best thing I can do is highlight what he's done at Sevilla, PSG, Valencia or Almeria. But if that fails to convince you, then that's fine.

Just on the Ferguson/Klopp/Guardiola argument.

The first thing I'll say is that these are just examples that illustrate the broader and more critical point which is that you need time/stability to build something successful. You may disagree with the examples I have chosen but do you also disagree with the broader point that time/stability are prerequisites to success?

The second thing is the "counterexamples" you mention do not invalidate the above. It's not because you have some coaches that had an average first season, and ultimately failed in subsequent seasons, that you can't have the reverse. I know what you'll say here: well, you're the one who cherry picked some examples and turned them into a general rule. That's not the case. These examples are purely illustrative. The key point I'm trying to get across is that you generally need time, stability and consistency to achieve success in this sport. That's just the way it is. You need time to get people to understand and adhere to your project. You need time to get the players to play the way you want them to play. You need time to shape the team in a way that works. You need time to sign the right players. Etc. None of these things happen overnight.

A truly pertinent counterexample would be one where a club is successful without time/stability/consistency. Real Madrid? Maybe. But this is a special case. And even then, I don't think this would invalidate the general trend that history shows. This is why I think Emery should be given more time - he's a good coach and must be given a real chance to succeed. He needs it and the club needs it.

Btw, what would your plan be if we sacked Emery by the end of the month? We'd appoint someone new (who?) and give him 12 months to succeed?

 

[Tir Na Nog]

What is mumble rap?

I know I could Google but I want to get to know my fellow posters.

It's basically a style of rapping that's come about in the last few years where the lyrics are often unclear. It's quite a loose term and sometimes it's used as a degrading term to describe most modern young rappers whether they "mumble" or not. Notable artists include 21 Savage, 6ix9ine, Fetty Wap, Lil Yachty and Travis Scott. They've all been labelled as mumble rappers. Many of those rappers don't even mumble tho so.....

 

[Maybe]

The team he put out yesterday was more or less full team. Those players should have been good enough to beat Brighton but they didn't. Which means as a club and establishment we weren't good enough for top 4. Simple.

So what you are saying is that we pay 5m or whatever the amount is to Emery to write down 11 players for the weekend game? Is that all he does? I would expect from someone who earns millions that he will force our players to reduce number of mistakes, remove them from the squad if they can't deliver that and be able to get more than 1 point from the last 4 games when battling for the CL spot.
Yes, we do blame Xhaka, Mustafi and Mkhi, you can check their threads, but Emery did cost us many points this season and I will blame him as much as I will blame Xhaka and Mustafi.
Many of our players are not good enough for this level, but I have yet to see any results from our manager this season. Hopefully it will be EL title.

 

[A_G]

Think the mod who came up with that poll is a **** stirrer of the highest order, tbh.

What **** stirring? It's a valid question consider the debate in this thread ffs.

 

[Mark Tobias]

What **** stirring? It's a valid question consider the debate in this thread ffs.

Haven't you noticed how we're not allowed to debate on this forum anymore?

 

[Camron]

It's basically a style of rapping that's come about in the last few years where the lyrics are often unclear. It's quite a loose term and sometimes it's used as a degrading term to describe most modern young rappers whether they "mumble" or not. Notable artists include 21 Savage, 6ix9ine, Fetty Wap, Lil Yachty and Travis Scott. They've all been labelled as mumble rappers. Many of those rappers don't even mumble tho so.....

Got a whole new world to explore. Is Harry Kane amongst them?

 

[A_G]

Haven't you noticed how we're not allowed to debate on this forum anymore?

Can't talk about anything without @GDeep or @arsenefc trying to shut down the discussion if they disagree.

 

[14Henry]

So what you are saying is that we pay 5m or whatever the amount is to Emery to write down 11 players for the weekend game? Is that all he does? I would expect from someone who earns millions that he will force our players to reduce number of mistakes, remove them from the squad if they can't deliver that and be able to get more than 1 point from the last 4 games when battling for the CL spot.
Yes, we do blame Xhaka, Mustafi and Mkhi, you can check their threads, but Emery did cost us many points this season and I will blame him as much as I will blame Xhaka and Mustafi.
Many of our players are not good enough for this level, but I have yet to see any results from our manager this season. Hopefully it will be EL title.

But you can't expect emery to say Xhaka/Mustafi/Miki your dropped and put in 3 under 21s. We have a generally crap squad of players where each is as bad as the other. It needs a complete overhaul so at the minute we have to play the best of a bad bunch.

Now if Mustafi is starting centre back next season and Miki is still going through the motions provided that Emery has at least had 80-100m to address it I will start to blame him.

It is never easy coming into what he did and he has steadied the ship. Hindsight looking now shows we really only needed 3-4 points more but as a squad and a club we couldn't do that and we can only accept it and see what next year brings.

Liverpool have had goalkeeping problems for years and Klopp was only able to address it this season. Liverpool fans could have said sack Klopp because he put his trust in not one but two dodgy keepers and should have played a younger goalkeeper. Building a team takes time you can't just say to 7-8 players your crap go sit on the bench while I put a young lad who has no experience in the team.

Let's gather some perspective people and use some common sense.

 

[Makingtrax]

Firstly thanks for the sensibse reply. Yes I am a big anti Emery individual, mainly because:

1. Our results are not there. Especially against the weaker teams that we should win. If the goal is to get back to the champions league money, he did a very poor job tactically most of those games.

2. Poor man management. He is known for not handling the PSG situation well, and hasn't really inspired the team holistically here. I don't see the fight, the constant fire and desire that was taunted. Emery fans will jump on the players, but it is the managers job to glue it all into the field.

3. He has been very dire with the football that he plays. It is predictable, it is suboptimal and it is plain boring to watch.

All in all he is not a man I would like to see in charge of Arsenal because I pride this club to be challenging for the title. It doesn't feel like Emery has even instilled a foundation for a team that could do so. It feels like he does not know what this team will be set up week in week out.

He is not the right person to be here for another 10 years. So why waste two years on him?

Your argument with Klopp and Guardiola do not hold because there are many counter examples. It is also cherry picked to fit into your argument to give Emery more time.

It doesn't take two years to build a team that will not collapse to crystal palace or Leicester the way Emery did.

Speaking as a massive Wenger fan who felt he out performed Kroenke’s spend right up until the fans took him down in the last 18 months of his tenure, I can’t agree about Emery.

Like every club the Arsenal transfer team over the years made some outstanding but also some poor calls. But towards the end of Wenger’s reign there we’re a number of bad decisions as the rants got louder. Perez and Mustafi for example we’re panic buys, Özil’s massive wage increase, running down Ramsey’s contract etc. Emery is living with those decisions taken under stress.

Things have calmed now and we can see the problems, ageing players like Kos and Monreal, Iwobi, Kola, Elneny, Mustafi, Lichsteiner not up to the calibre we need, Ramsey, Welbeck leaving, non of the youngsters looking like top 4 players yet (including Guendouzi, but who shows potential certainly).

A squad is only as good as it’s weakest players and we have lots of them. The reason Emery is tinkering all the time is because he keeps seeing problems and is trying to mitigate them by rotation, substitutions and altering tactics. He’s a proactive manager, not a style manager like Wenger, Pep, Klopp etc.

I’d certainly give him another year or two, to see if we can get some better players on the cheap.

 

[Maybe]

Building a team takes time you can't just say to 7-8 players your crap go sit on the bench while I put a young lad who has no experience in the team.

I get that part, but we'll see what happens in the summer. I have a bad feeling we'll keep most of this ****** around and complain about them next year. But this is not Emery's job, we have scouts and the board who are responsible for that. Emery's job is to prepare the team, something he didn't do too well in recent times.

 

[rich 1990]

What **** stirring? It's a valid question consider the debate in this thread ffs.

It's not valid at all, ffs. We've mocked every other club for not giving their managers a proper go, why are pressing to go down the same route? The poll is only validating the opinions of the more stupid on this forum. He's not getting sacked, that's it.

 

[GDeep™]

Can't talk about anything without @GDeep or @arsenefc trying to shut down the discussion if they disagree.

**** off.

 

[14Henry]

I get that part, but we'll see what happens in the summer. I have a bad feeling we'll keep most of this ****** around and complain about them next year. But this is not Emery's job, we have scouts and the board who are responsible for that. Emery's job is to prepare the team, something he didn't do too well in recent times.

The things is in any walk of life you need time. If you change careers or move departments in work it may take you 3-6 months before you are performing optimally.

Now imagine your in charge of a sales team and in your team some of them have either been in the job so long they lack enthusiasm or they just aren't good enough. While you can try all day to motivate them and encourage them and coach them while some of them may improve a little you may find that the majority either show a small up turn in performance followed by going back to old patterns or just no improvement at all.

You can't then say everyone sacked. Otherwise you don't have a business at all. This is no different Emery has taken over a poor aging squad and is try to week by week tinker to see how these mediocre players can get a result. Sometimes it works perfectly but we have seen these players perform better against the big teams yet fail at the weaker ones which shows that these players maybe think get should win easy and therefore don't switch on enough.

Emery can shout and rant and rave but some players just aren't good enough.

It will be interesting what happens next year. People are saying about lacking a style but this season was results based. Not playing attract football. Let's see what the summer brings.

 

[hydrofluoric acid]

It's basically a style of rapping that's come about in the last few years where the lyrics are often unclear. It's quite a loose term and sometimes it's used as a degrading term to describe most modern young rappers whether they "mumble" or not. Notable artists include 21 Savage, 6ix9ine, Fetty Wap, Lil Yachty and Travis Scott. They've all been labelled as mumble rappers. Many of those rappers don't even mumble tho so.....

Check out number 14.