Fabio Vieira: The Portuguese Project

[Gooner Zig]

We have to remember that there's a big difference playing with a heavily rotated Europa style first XI vs our first choice XI. Look at how average Eddie looked at times in some of the Europa games as opposed to how he looks when Ødegaard, Saka and Martinelli are playing with him.

Still has a lot of developing to do but the talent is there, that's not debatable.

 

[Rasmi]

We have to remember that there's a big difference playing with a heavily rotated Europa style first XI vs our first choice XI. Look at how average Eddie looked at times in some of the Europa games as opposed to how he looks when Ødegaard, Saka and Martinelli are playing with him.

Still has a lot of developing to do but the talent is there, that's not debatable.

He doesn’t look average. He looks weak. Big difference

 

[pigge]

He doesn’t look average. He looks weak. Big difference

Physicality luckily is one of the easiest thing to improve as a footballer(and human) and its even easier as a footballer as it is part of your job. Eat+gym =guaranteed success

 

[Bucephalus]

Sending him to Huddersfield in a rubbish league with rubbish players won’t do him any good and is waste of time. He is better than that as he excelled in Portugal

I give him time because he is still showing moments of quality. He needs to pick his moments better and his battles better though

Ok, maybe Huddersfield is a bit extreme, though if I recall, a young ESR spent a year there and came back the better for the experience.

And just to be clear, I have no doubts about Viera's technical quality, only his adjustment to the physicality of the English game. And the only way he's going to adjust is by getting regular minutes in the English game. Sure his technical ability is way above Championship levels. But a Championship loan can still be a great place for a young, slight of stature player to get those minutes and adapt to the physicality. (And, as I said, my opinion could very well change if he gets significant Premier League minutes with Xhaka and Partey instead of Sambi and Elneny).

 

[scytheavatar]

Physicality luckily is one of the easiest thing to improve as a footballer(and human) and its even easier as a footballer as it is part of your job. Eat+gym =guaranteed success

You can gain muscle mass but to do so without affecting your speed and cardio is not easy........ why do you think guys like Denilson and Torreira remain stick insects for their career? Vieira is not that young of a player too so if he is supposed to improve physically he needs to show that improvement rapidly. How many players can you think of that is physically weak at 22 years old but becomes fine later in his career?

 

[TheGreatWright8]

You can gain muscle mass but to do so without affecting your speed and cardio is not easy........ why do you think guys like Denilson and Torreira remain stick insects for their career? Vieira is not that young of a player too so if he is supposed to improve physically he needs to show that improvement rapidly. How many players can you think of that is physically weak at 22 years old but becomes fine later in his career?

Eddie is a perfect example of that he was weak at 22 and look at his physical transformation.

 

[Batman]

You can gain muscle mass but to do so without affecting your speed and cardio is not easy........ why do you think guys like Denilson and Torreira remain stick insects for their career? Vieira is not that young of a player too so if he is supposed to improve physically he needs to show that improvement rapidly. How many players can you think of that is physically weak at 22 years old but becomes fine later in his career?

Entirely untrue. Mbappe, CR7, Ronaldinho and Goretzka just to name a few all started rail thin and packed on muscle with no drop off in speed or endurance. It's not like footballers are 250+lb heavyweigh boxers or MMA fighters having to avoid being knocked unconscious for 3 minutes at a time. That's a different kind of stamina.

My speed and endurance are better now at 34 and almost 200 lbs than half a lifetime ago at 17 when I weighed 140 lbs and I'm neither a world class athlete nor do I have PL level strength and conditioning coaches and nutritionists working with me. Athletes with access to the best nutrition and training in the world are more than capable of increasing their size and strength without impacting performance, particularly in their early 20's when they're entering their metabolic peak.

Vieira probably just hasn't devoted time to that aspect of his conditioning because prior to being in England, he didn't need to. There's no good scientific reason to believe that gaining some muscle would adversely affect his performance or to believe that getting stronger=hulking out. Just getting better at proprioception, particularly of his stabilizer muscles could easily translate to better being able to hold off challenges and it wouldn't produce a huge discernible difference in size.

 

[El Duderino]

Entirely untrue. Mbappe, CR7, Ronaldinho and Goretzka just to name a few all started rail thin and packed on muscle with no drop off in speed or endurance. It's not like footballers are 250+lb heavyweigh boxers or MMA fighters having to avoid being knocked unconscious for 3 minutes at a time. That's a different kind of stamina.

My speed and endurance are better now at 34 and almost 200 lbs than half a lifetime ago at 17 when I weighed 140 lbs and I'm neither a world class athlete nor do I have PL level strength and conditioning coaches and nutritionists working with me. Athletes with access to the best nutrition and training in the world are more than capable of increasing their size and strength without impacting performance, particularly in their early 20's when they're entering their metabolic peak.

Vieira probably just hasn't devoted time to that aspect of his conditioning because prior to being in England, he didn't need to. There's no good scientific reason to believe that gaining some muscle would adversely affect his performance or to believe that getting stronger=hulking out. Just getting better at proprioception, particularly of his stabilizer muscles could easily translate to better being able to hold off challenges and it wouldn't produce a huge discernible difference in size.

Don't know about the other two, but Ronaldinho and Goretzka both got pumped filled with asthma medicine......

 

[bastun]

Entirely untrue. Mbappe, CR7, Ronaldinho and Goretzka just to name a few all started rail thin and packed on muscle with no drop off in speed or endurance. It's not like footballers are 250+lb heavyweigh boxers or MMA fighters having to avoid being knocked unconscious for 3 minutes at a time. That's a different kind of stamina.

My speed and endurance are better now at 34 and almost 200 lbs than half a lifetime ago at 17 when I weighed 140 lbs and I'm neither a world class athlete nor do I have PL level strength and conditioning coaches and nutritionists working with me. Athletes with access to the best nutrition and training in the world are more than capable of increasing their size and strength without impacting performance, particularly in their early 20's when they're entering their metabolic peak.

Vieira probably just hasn't devoted time to that aspect of his conditioning because prior to being in England, he didn't need to. There's no good scientific reason to believe that gaining some muscle would adversely affect his performance or to believe that getting stronger=hulking out. Just getting better at proprioception, particularly of his stabilizer muscles could easily translate to better being able to hold off challenges and it wouldn't produce a huge discernible difference in size.

Also they cannot overload his body during the season. We'll see a lot better Vieira when he gets a proper preseason with full workout plan.You can clearly see his talent. Final 3rd decisions are top tier.

 

[Batman]

Don't know about the other two, but Ronaldinho and Goretzka both got pumped filled with asthma medicine......

Even if they did, their athletic performance didn't decline with more muscle mass. It improved.

 

[db10_therza]

Even if they did, their athletic performance didn't decline with more muscle mass. It improved.

It’s just a weird take. Ever seen the physique of 100m sprinters? They’re built like brick **** houses… you can pack on fast twitch / explosive muscles at the gym, you just need the right workout routine.

 

[dashsnow17]

For a young player coming from Liga Nos to PL who hasn’t even played half a season yet, I’d say he’s doing fine. He’s made decisive contributions. Still a lot of work to do obviously but I wouldn’t be down on him at all.

People saying “yeah he’s scored or assisted but he was invisible apart from that”…hm, scoring or assisting is by far the hardest thing to do in football, so if he’s doing it probs no need to panic.

 

[dashsnow17]

Lokonga has been here 18 months and I don’t remember him making a single contribution in any game. That’s a flop signing.

 

[pigge]

You can gain muscle mass but to do so without affecting your speed and cardio is not easy........ why do you think guys like Denilson and Torreira remain stick insects for their career? Vieira is not that young of a player too so if he is supposed to improve physically he needs to show that improvement rapidly. How many players can you think of that is physically weak at 22 years old but becomes fine later in his career?

Other people have answered, but if a person want to improve their sprint speed they would need to add a lot of muscles, most sprinters are quite big and ripped with big legs. You will have worse stamina over time, but adding muscles(not any muscles tbf) will get you faster rather than slower. You might lose some agility though, but thats not always the case. unless you add huge muscles, which obviously won't be necessary here.

 

[db10_therza]

Other people have answered, but if a person want to improve their sprint speed they would need to add a lot of muscles, most sprinters are quite big and ripped with big legs. You will have worse stamina over time, but adding muscles(not any muscles tbf) will get you faster rather than slower. You might lose some agility though, but thats not always the case. unless you add huge muscles, which obviously won't be necessary here.

I had to do a very basic version of this when I took up boxing. Where I used to use “time under tension” for hypertrophy the trainer had me doing explosive reps instead. Mudryks video of him squatting that some one posted here earlier is a good example actually. Instead of the normal ass-to-the-grass full range squat you just isolate one part of the motion and do it explosively.

 

[drippin]

Lokonga has been here 18 months and I don’t remember him making a single contribution in any game. That’s a flop signing.

It was done as a cheap punt for depth that backfired, that's what 15 million pounds get you usually nowadays.

Hopefully he will fetch half of that money back.

Flop yeah, but not very serious and understandable.

 

[Batman]

It’s just a weird take. Ever seen the physique of 100m sprinters? They’re built like brick **** houses… you can pack on fast twitch / explosive muscles at the gym, you just need the right workout routine.

Definitely. It's the take of someone who doesn't know anything at all about physiology or exercise science. Adama Traore doesn't look like he has any trouble moving, does he? If I had to guess, Vieira probably weighs like 135 lbs, if that. If he puts on 10lbs of muscle it most assuredly won't kill his cardiovascular endurance or turn of pace. Just nonsensical.

 

[Batman]

Also they cannot overload his body during the season. We'll see a lot better Vieira when he gets a proper preseason with full workout plan.You can clearly see his talent. Final 3rd decisions are top tier.

Exactly. Let's let him bed in, get a full offseason with the training staff under his belt and then assess where he is. Ødegaard was no stronger than Vieira is now this time last year and look at how much stronger he is on the ball today.

 

[Maybe]

Definitely. It's the take of someone who doesn't know anything at all about physiology or exercise science. Adama Traore doesn't look like he has any trouble moving, does he? If I had to guess, Vieira probably weighs like 135 lbs, if that. If he puts on 10lbs of muscle it most assuredly won't kill his cardiovascular endurance or turn of pace. Just nonsensical.

Adama Traore doesn't have to be agile, for him it's only important that he runs fast, so muscles are actually beneficial for his game.

If you take a look at what some current and past players similar in style to Vieira looked like (Iniesta, Silva, Bernardo, Xavi, Modric, Rosicky), they all have lean physiques and are very agile.

Agree with the rest, if he adds 10lbs of muscle, it would be extremely beneficial. Think he is weaker than all the players I've mentioned, a bit extreme for a PL player no matter what his style

 

[Batman]

Adama Traore doesn't have to be agile, for him it's only important that he runs fast, so muscles are actually beneficial for his game.

If you take a look at what some current and past players similar in style to Vieira looked like (Iniesta, Silva, Bernardo, Xavi, Modric, Rosicky), they all have lean physiques and are very agile.

Agree with the rest, if he adds 10lbs of muscle, it would be extremely beneficial. Think he is weaker than all the players I've mentioned, a bit extreme for a PL player no matter what his style

Yes, what I was responding to was the assertion made in the original post that adding muscle would somehow slow him down. Worth noting however that the NFL is full of players built like Adama Traore who are incredibly agile so again, muscle does not impede your agility if you are training properly to maintain your agility. Nobody expects Vieira to come back looking like Schwarzenegger at any rate.