PL | Arsenal vs Chelsea | 3rd of January @ 19:45 GMT | Sky Sports

[FinnGooner]

AMN was tripped in the first half and no pen was called.

You probably wanna watch the replay. AMN tripped in his own legs.

 

[redanddread]

The conspiracy theorists are out in force again. We've got some ****e calls down the years no doubt and particularly this season but the simple fact is that we've not played well bar (less) than a handful of games this season. Maybe if we actually played better football and thus scored a few more goals and conceded less then we wouldn't be so affected by poor refereeing decisions which occur in every game & for every team.

 

[BobP]

Yes that's right individual skills on how to use your body to get ahead of your opponent and one on one defending something you develop as kid growing up . Which is why I found some of Callum defending strange , he didn't defend his line to the ball when he and Morata were chasing the ball , even though he had the advantage and ended up getting outmuscled which was ridiculous .

He was a midfielder growing up if I'm not mistaken and was then moved back into the RB position by Poch. Not long after he made the move to a team which played in a way which wasn't exactly kind to defenders.

Think some of the nuances of being a CB have been lost on Callum, considering the trajectory of his development.

 

[BobP]

Can't say i agree but i get what you're saying.
Regardless of coaching i would expect to see individual brilliance, but neither Holding nor Chambers has anything special about them. Atleast a guy like Christensen showcases he's a composed ball playing CB.
I dont see what Holding or Chambers excel at.

But what is individual brilliance?

Does Holding's performance in the FA Cup final when he was up against Costa count as individual brilliance?

If we're talking about instances of individual brilliance within a game its often after the defence or even a said defender has ****ed up that the opportunity to showcase individual brilliance becomes possible.

Not a great position to be in.

The ability to perform such feats would also depend on a players physical composition and attributes. For instance, you wouldn't see Mertesacker perform incredible defensive feats but you wouldn't call him an unexceptional defensive player, far from it.

 

[Gooner Zig]

If Chelsea had a better striker than Morata they would have absolutely buried us. We were 2nd best throughout the pitch.

Morata had those chances because our defence are a bunch of gimps. We controlled the vast majority of the game.

 

[CJJ]

You probably wanna watch the replay. AMN tripped in his own legs.

No he didnt. You can see the contact + logically you can't fake that movement with the leg without contact.

 

[celestis]

He was a midfielder growing up if I'm not mistaken and was then moved back into the RB position by Poch. Not long after he made the move to a team which played in a way which wasn't exactly kind to defenders.

Think some of the nuances of being a CB have been lost on Callum, considering the trajectory of his development.

Yeah he was always ear marked as a future centre back as Southampton but played in different positions to add to his development so his ex coach says . Using your body to even up a straight out race isn't just for CB's though . Just surprised how easy he was beaten in a position where he had the advantage .

 

[BobP]

Yeah he was always ear marked as a future centre back as Southampton but played in different positions to add to his development so his ex coach says . Using your body to even up a straight out race isn't just for CB's though . Just surprised how easy he was beaten in a position where he had the advantage .

Was this for that Morata chance where there was some miscommunication between Chambers and Mustafi?

 

[celestis]

Was this for that Morata chance where there was some miscommunication between Chambers and Mustafi?

Nah 2nd half when Xhaka lost the ball .

 

[CJJ]

But what is individual brilliance?

Does Holding's performance in the FA Cup final when he was up against Costa count as individual brilliance?

If we're talking about instances of individual brilliance within a game its often after the defence or even a said defender has ****ed up that the opportunity to showcase individual brilliance becomes possible.

Not a great position to be in.

The ability to perform such feats would also depend on a players physical composition and attributes. For instance, you wouldn't see Mertesacker perform incredible defensive feats but you wouldn't call him an unexceptional defensive player, far from it.

Individual brilliance might be a wrong label, but lets call it a clear identity instead. Are they 1v1 players? ball playing defenders? Speed to recover?
They tick none of those boxes for me and i'd argue they don't excel at anything at the top level.
Mertesacker's anticipation and composure combined with strength and height made him special.

 

[FinnGooner]

No he didnt. You can see the contact + logically you can't fake that movement with the leg without contact.

Look, I saw the close up replay and I know exactly what I saw. AMNs back leg hit his front leg and he fell. He didn't fake anything, it was just an unfortunate stumble.

 

[rich 1990]

I think people think it was a penalty because it was Hazard and the sun shines out of his arse apparently. Personally can't stand him and think he's hugely overrated.

 

[Sudders]

Yes that's right individual skills on how to use your body to get ahead of your opponent and one on one defending something you develop as kid growing up . Which is why I found some of Callum defending strange , he didn't defend his line to the ball when he and Morata were chasing the ball , even though he had the advantage and ended up getting outmuscled which was ridiculous .

Exactly.

Chambers looked like a great young prospect in his early days, as did holding. It can't be a coincidence that they both look like nervous little kids who can't complete the simplest of passes and dwell too long on the ball.

I'd love some posters on here to try and demonstrate what a kick is... Probably like our defense they'd miss their original target and land on their arses looking the fool they are.

We have to remember this is the premier league. A league that has some of the biggest competition and rewards going and therefore teams will try anything to win. We can complain about it as much as we like but where has that got us over the last 15 years? From Rooney's dive to Hazard's over reacting, if we can't stop it and we can't adapt our defending to it then bloody we'll start doing the same at the over end and.

 

[rich 1990]

It's not difficult to sum up the ref's decisions.

Hazard dived.
Wilshere should have been sent off.
Maitland Niles fell over fresh air.

The ref got one out of three right which by PL standards, is quite good.

 

[BobP]

Individual brilliance might be a wrong label, but lets call it a clear identity instead. Are they 1v1 players? ball playing defenders? Speed to recover?
They tick none of those boxes for me and i'd argue they don't excel at anything at the top level.
Mertesacker's anticipation and composure combined with strength and height made him special.

1v1 defending is a tough one. For instance, what can you expect Holding to do when isolated against someone Mane in a transition situation? It's literally the worst position to be in. You could place most defenders in a situation like that and they'd be licked.

Ball playing is more dependent on context and structure. A defender could be an exceptional passer of the ball but if the distances and lanes connecting him to his teammates are nonexistent, that wouldn't be evident.

For instance, think back the our 3-4 defeat to Liverpool at the beginning of last season where both Holding and Chambers were the starting CBs. Liverpool focused on cutting off the CBs from the midfield, something which was further compounded by the fact that the Wenger's 6 fails to consistently show for the ball in an aggressive manner. This consequently led to Chambers and Holding either passing to one another or being forced to riskier passes which led to compromising situations. You can hardly point to their individual failings as a means by which to explain why we struggled to play out in that game.

 

[Sudders]

Personally I can see why it was given but FYI Bellerin never argues Pen decisions, even when they are a stone cold travesty of justice.

I suspect he may be a simpleton.

Lol, he may well be.

I do think there's a difference in reactions though, if he'd have thrown both arms up in disgust at Hazard then it might have put doubt in the refs mind instead of a pleading finger in his direction.

 

[Sudders]

Look, I saw the close up replay and I know exactly what I saw. AMNs back leg hit his front leg and he fell. He didn't fake anything, it was just an unfortunate stumble.

Relays show AMN getting infront of Moses and then unfortunately his heel knocks Moses knee causing it to but his own leg and trip over.

An unfortunate coming together but Moses never breaks stride and for me it's not a penalty.

 

[Sniper Mik]

Morata had those chances because our defence are a bunch of gimps. We controlled the vast majority of the game.

I don't know what you mean by control. If you're referring to possession maybe yes. But Chelsea had by far the better chances, quality wise and quantity. We were very fortunate last night. Morata could've had a hattrick, Bakayoko could've scored two. Cesc missed a glorious chance, Zappacosta hit the post. I may have even missed a few.

 

[Gooner Zig]

I don't know what you mean by control. If you're referring to possession maybe yes. But Chelsea had by far the better chances, quality wise and quantity. We were very fortunate last night. Morata could've had a hattrick, Bakayoko could've scored two. Cesc missed a glorious chance, Zappacosta hit the post. I may have even missed a few.

Almost all those incidents were completely against the run of play and not crafted by Chelsea. They were a direct result of shambolic defending.

- Lacazette should have had at least one goal
- Alexis hitting the post twice in one phase

These come directly to my mind straight away, there are a few others that I've forgotten.

 

[FinnGooner]

Relays show AMN getting infront of Moses and then unfortunately his heel knocks Moses knee causing it to but his own leg and trip over.

An unfortunate coming together but Moses never breaks stride and for me it's not a penalty.

Yes, I agree not a penalty. I meant that AMNs own back leg hit his own front leg. It's very clear in the replay