Player Ratings - LC: Arsenal vs Wigan | 11/11/08

[Rohit]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

My Ratings;

Nothing wrong in getting carried away and over-excited Ricky if you can handle disappointment later on, if and when it comes.

I'd rather read that than some of what is posted on here in the garb of realism, which is only as true as what you have posted.

 

[gunnerGH]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Fab 6
Hoyte 6
Song 7
Djourou 7
Gibbs 7
Randall 5
Merida 6
Ramsey 7
Wilshere 8
Simpson 8
Vela 8

Fonte 5
Lansbury 5
Bishoff 5

 

[albakos]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Did anyone see the ratings from Sun for Manure players.

Their bench is made up of our subs..

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/article1920373.ece" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... 920373.ece</a>





Their game was boring compared to ours, even Sun staff saiduh, who cares for their bench, lets copy/paste !

 

[ricky1985]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

ricky, you use the term 'world class' way too easily. believe it or not, we're not the only team with great young players. united have a few as well, with rafael and anderson being just two of them. barca are absolutely loaded with young players and i believe they beat someone like 6-0 a few weeks ago with a very young team. the media love to hype our carling cup side as much they love to bash the wussiness of our senior side. as always, the truth is somewhere in the middle.

You dont think Fabianski, Djourou, Wilshere, Ramsey and Vela have the potential to be world class one day soon?

It was Valladolid, and Barcelona only had two players under the age of 25; Messi and Pique, and most of the others were far older than that.
Barcelona dont have 16/17 that are in Wilshere and Ramsey's league. We knew about Messi long before he burst on the scene, why? Because he was so damn good. Thats the type of talent we are talking about here with Ramsey and Wilshere.

If you think Man United have any talents to match Djourou, Ramsey, Wilshere, and Vela (barring perhaps Rafeal, only going by that goal), then thats your opinion. But I dont agree at all.

I dont need the media to indoctrinate me into believing black is black or white is white. I have watched football for a long time, and I know talent when I see it. A few of our young players are absolutely incredible and have as good a chance as any to make it to the very top. Call that world class or top drawer, I dont mind, it doesnt matter.

Fact is too many Arsenal fans are not letting themselves get excited about the amazing talent that we have nurtured. I am not sure why? Fear of them failing and us looking stupid, after bigging them up.

I just call it as it, When Rooney was 16 he looked incredible, guess what he is incredible (at least in terms of ability). When Cesc was 16 he looked incredible, guess what he is even better than that now.

A good player is a good player at any age, and 4 or 5 of our kids yesterday looked INCREDIBLE.

 

[Clrnc]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Ricky, I rewatched the match and it was certainly a very good performance from us, but far too early to judge them tbh. And we must think playing at home helps alot for our youngsters too. We will be getting an away tie for the quarters and lets further see from there eh.

Anyway my ratings after rewatching the match

Fabianski 7 - made 2 early misjudgement in cross, but grown in stature and produced some magnificent saves

Hoyte 6 - Not a very good match, but I know he is played out of position

Djourou 8 - Fantastic performance, should challenge for first team soon

Song 7 - Dominant in the air

Gibbs 6.5 - Very poor defensively, but solid attacking wise. Winger played as fullback and if he wants to be our new leftback, he needs to work on his defensive aspect

Merida 7 - Technically brilliant, but needs to track back more often. Typical old fashion kind of left winger

Randall 5.5 - Very shaky, alot of misplaced passes, tried to many fanciful skills didn't keep it simple. Not as good a performance as the Sheff one

Ramsey 8.5 - Amazing performance, Can't believe what I was seeing at times with his passing. Easy to forget he is just 17

Wilshere 8 - Great potential, will surely have a future here as a attacking mid played on the wings like how Arsène likes to

Simpson 7.5 - Good poacher, but unfortunately I can't see him making it here. Very clumsy at times, looks like Leroy Lita kind of player

Vela 9 - One wonders why he don't start for the first team...

Subs
Fonte 5
Lansbury 5
Bischoff 5

 

[kamikaze80]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

You dont think Fabianski, Djourou, Wilshere, Ramsey and Vela have the potential to be world class one day soon?

fabianski and djourou look good. ramsey looks very good. wilshere and vela look like potential top class players, yes. i'm pretty pumped about them, although you seem to insist that i'm not.

It was Valladolid, and Barcelona only had two players under the age of 25; Messi and Pique, and most of the others were far older than that. Barcelona dont have 16/17 that are in Wilshere and Ramsey's league.

i'm pretty sure it was a different game, mightve been CL. messi is 21 and maybe the best player in the world, so right off the bat, they have an advantage. bojan scored 10 goals in la liga last season at the age of 17, so he's another absurd talent. they have this busquet kid who's tall and skillful. pique is a fantastic talent as well. and i'm sure they have more coming through that we don't know about simply because we dont follow the barca youth.

 

[Rohit]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

I personally don not want to compare our youth to what other clubs have. Can we simply celebrate the fact that we do have some amazing talent?

What also struck me last night was the intelligence of each and every player on the pitch that was wearing an Arsenal t-shirt.

 

[Gooner_Stu]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Whats clear at the moment,is that the lads are a great cup team. Putting them in the league, atleast as a unit, would be a massive gamble. But players, notably Vela, Ramsey, Wilshere (of the younger lads) are already there, but more on an individual basis. But theres nothing to say this is their cup for the taking. The difference in quality as opposition between Sheffield Utd and Wigan is far, far bigger then many would thing, and for these lads to play and beat them in such a way is incredible. Anyway, my ratings.

Fabianski 8 - Double save worthy of any "World Class" 'keeper.

Hoyte 6.5 - Solid performance, but not as noticable as others.

Djourou 7.5 - Solid, and forgiven for the *handball*

Song 7 - Solid Performance,

Gibbs 6.5 - Needs to work on defensive ability, but is great going forward.

Merida 7 - Learn to help his defender and he's good to go, otherwise very good.

Randall 6.5 - Solid Performance

Ramsey 8.5 - Only 17 you say? Playing beyond his years

Wilshere 9 -. The only one to beat Ramsey/Vela to MotM. Grow older already!!!

Simpson 7.5 - Doing his best to silence some doubters, well deserved brace.

Vela 8.5 - Giving Wenger a headache on the Striker front. Surley deserves more time in the league action? Great goal, great performance.

 

[ricky1985]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

fabianski and djourou look good. ramsey looks very good. wilshere and vela look like potential top class players, yes. i'm pretty pumped about them, although you seem to insist that i'm not.

You said I used the term 'world class' too easily? You were referring to my predictions for those players, no?

messi is 21 and maybe the best player in the world, so right off the bat, they have an advantage. bojan scored 10 goals in la liga last season at the age of 17, so he's another absurd talent. they have this busquet kid who's tall and skillful. pique is a fantastic talent as well.

Fabregas is 21 and virtually the best player in the world, so I dont see the advantage?
Bojan is extremely talented, as talented as Vela, I'm not so sure, but I hear what you are saying.
Pique represents quite a weak arguement there mate, as we all know Man United dont let 'fantastic talents' leave, let alone for only a few million quid.

I have heard a bit about Busquet, but I swear if he is even half as talented as Aaron Ramsey, then I will eat my Arsenal shirt and start supporting Tottenham.

and i'm sure they have more coming through that we don't know about simply because we dont follow the barca youth.

I knew about Messi before he exploded, I had heard all about him and he didnt dissapoint. Same with Bojan, I have heard about him since he was 14 or 15 years old. Same with Gio Dos Santos, same with Fran Merida.
We are all well informed, and quite simply we have more talent than they do, in quantites they can only strive towards.

 

[SimplyFabregas]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Sssshhhhhh let's not mention where we got Cesc from.


Can't we all just be happy that we have some of the best youngsters in the world coming through, and not go round in circles about who has the best academy.

The list of players that have come through Barca in the last few years is pretty incredible, to be fair and if we can match that record then we will have some fantastic players on our hands.

 

[patrick42uk]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Barca have a lot of class u-16s

 

[kamikaze80]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

i just dont get why people get mad everytime i suggest that every arsenal player may not necessarily be the best in the world at his position. yes, fabregas, ramsey, wilshere, vela is right up there with messi, bojan, pique, busquet. yes, denilson is a promising player but he's flawed at the moment. so what?

to suggest that fabianski and djourou are potential world class shows a bit of supporter bias, i think. i suppose jonny evans is potential world class as well? if so, what about x, y and z at club a, b and c? all of a sudden, we've got a huge bunch of potential world class players.

 

[SimplyFabregas]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Its proberly because some people are sick of the pessimism that surrounds Arsenal on this forum, i know i am.

 

[ricky1985]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

i just dont get why people get mad everytime i suggest that every arsenal player may not necessarily be the best in the world at his position. yes, fabregas, ramsey, wilshere, vela is right up there with messi, bojan, pique, busquet. yes, denilson is a promising player but he's flawed at the moment. so what?

to suggest that fabianski and djourou are potential world class shows a bit of supporter bias, i think. i suppose jonny evans is potential world class as well? if so, what about x, y and z at club a, b and c? all of a sudden, we've got a huge bunch of potential world class players.

If you are referring to me mate, I promise you I'm not mad at all. I just believe in what I say, and am happy to debate with people who feel differently.

 

[King Puck Paddy]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

The words "World class" are used far too much these days,players who have yet to even start a Premiership game can hardly even have those words in the same sentence as their name.Arsenal have a very good youth setup,we always had that.Some of the players will make it,most of them will make it at other teams other than Arsenal.

Obviously there are a few stand out talents (Vela,Ramsey,Wilshere,Fabianski) who will certainly be a part of Arsenal in the future but I fear that a lot of the rest will have to move on to find first team football.Djourou is another player that is held in high regard by Wenger,look at it this way Djourou is still here while Senderos is gone to Milan on loan.That tells you a lot about the faith Arsène has in Johann's ability.He has all the right atributes and the perfect physical frame to become a top centre back,It has to be said that he is an unsung hero of this Carling Cup side.

Personally I think that out of these five players I've mentioned,Djourou is the only one who should be in our first team right now.Ramsey looks like he will be an amazing player but he could hardly play alongside Cesc,Wilshere has shown what he can do but we have better options in wide areas at the moment.Fabianski will be our number one next season,but for now Its better to let him gain invaluable experience and gradually take over from Almunia.Vela should get more playing time,that's for sure but he is still young and we have so many other options already up front.Van persie,Adebayor,Bendtner and Eduardo are still deserved of a place ahead of the Mexican.

What I'm trying to say without putting a damper on these lads is,they are still very young and have time on there side.I think we have some special players that need to be slowly introduced into big time football,there would be no point in throwing Wilshere into a pressure situation where the spotlight would be firmly on him.If he than had a poor performance,It could have a detrimental effect on the young lads progression as a footballer.Walcott is a perfect example of this,being picked for the World cup squad definately put his career on the back-foot.Only now Theo is starting to show that he is a class act,but even Wenger admitted last season that he was behind schedule.

I would describe these guys as potentially very good players,they all no doubt have great futures ahead of them.But lets not put the unneeded pressure of "World class" tags on such young shoulders.

 

[USArsenal]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Its proberly because some people are sick of the pessimism that surrounds Arsenal on this forum, i know i am.

well, there's a difference between pessimism and realism... Kami wouldnt be what I would call a serial pessimist (that would be kel or sabre or even more Dos) but he does try to look at things through not as heavily tinted Arsenal-colored glasses...

as supporters of Arsenal, we tend to think our youngsters are the next coming of God, and while some of them will be successful at the club, most others will not.. they might be successful somewhere else at a lower team..

Kami is right that not every youngster we have is going to be fantastic for club and country for years to come... some players its obvious they will (Ramsey, Vela, Wilshere), but others may not blossom until they leave here and still others wont blossom at all..

its the natural circle of life in football...

 

[Macho]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Fab 7- I like him.

Hoyte 7

Song 7

Djourou 7

Gibbs 7- I actually thought he was good, and a little suprised at some of the ratings here.

Randall 6- Im not a fan, but not as bad as people say he was.

Merida 6- One or two brilliant moments, did some weird stuff at times.
Also, he kept drifting to the centre leaving Gibbs on his own.

Ramsey 8- What a player. Seriously this guy is gonna make it here- soon.

Wilshere 7- Good but wasn't that great. Prefered Ramsey.

Simpson 8- Hungry, ran the channels.

Vela 6- Didn't think he was that good..I dunno what he was doing when he had that earlier chances..after that, he looked short of confidence..went missing- and for Simpsons first goal- that ball was actually for Vela but it was like he didn't want to get onto the end of it...

Maybe Im being hasrsh- but like Wilshere I didn't think he was that good. Nice goal though.



Fonte 5
Lansbury 5
Bishoff 5

 

[law]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

As with the our youth vs Barca youth debate it seems obvious that the difference in leagues makes an increible difference. When someone claim the Wigan weren't putting in as much effort and closing us down as quickly as they would in the Premiership then in the same breath point to Barca's talent it really begs the question - have they ever watched La Liga? We play in the most physical, high-tempo league in the world. The two things young players are going to struggle the most to deal with. Technique is the first thing to develop, physical strength and decision making are the last. The gap in difficulty between a very young player managing to make an impact in Spain and doing the same in the Premiership is absolutely huge. I'm sure Barca have some great young players but in terms of quantity and quality I very much doubt there's are on the same level as ours. Regardless having a you set-up that is only as good as Barca's is not little achievement anyway.

 

[ricky1985]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Who said anything about 'every youngster being fantastic for club and country for years to come'?

Come on no one is stupid here its obvious that not all of our youngsters are going to make it here, in fact the majority wont. We are celebrating the fact that last night the club we all love, fielded a team full of teenagers that annihilated a good Premier League team.

It's the best generation of youngsters we have ever produced, and we can take pride in the fact that those who do not quite make the grade here will make very respectable careers at slightly lesser clubs, at Premier League level no doubt.

But what is so exciting is that there were 4 or 5 players on show last night that can play for Arsenal, and we are getting to watch them grow and improve.

Tell me you're not proud of the way in which the club you love has built a system and footballing culture that enables them to field a team of kids that can play like that?

 

[King Puck Paddy]

Re: Arsenal vs Wigan Player Ratings

Tell me you're not proud of the way in which the club you love has built a system and footballing culture that enables them to field a team of kids that can play like that?

I share your optimism Ricky but I fear we are the new Ajax of European football