Youri Tielemans

[arghhhh]

Such a shame that the best midfield partner we gave Santi for balance was Coquelin

Stubborn Wenger, rubbish scouting, useless board

 

[lomekian]

Tielemans looks more like a very poor version of what Cesc was as our main CM, than Santi, in terms of style.

Really hope this doesn't happen, think it will be a terrible signing.

While I disagree with your conclusion, Cesc lite is good comparison. My view is that Tielemans isn't worth what it would have cost to have bought him a year ago, but if the figures circulating are real, he would improve our midfield a bit without breaking the bank.
Not a dream signing, but we haven't had anyone who could play through balls from a deeper position since peak Santi, and no-one doing it consistently since Cesc. That alone makes him a very interesting proposition

 

[Let's play Aubamawang]

It's worth bearing in mind Tielemans was seen as a coup when Leicester first signed him. He may have regressed recently, but there IS a very talented player there.

 

[benjamin86]

It's worth bearing in mind Tielemans was seen as a coup when Leicester first signed him. He may have regressed recently, but there IS a very talented player there.

I don't think he's regressed, Ndidi's been injured most of the season so Tielemans has been paired with Mendy or Dewsbury Hall who are nowhere near as good.

 

[Rasmi]

I don't think he's regressed, Ndidi's been injured most of the season so Tielemans has been paired with Mendy or Dewsbury Hall who are nowhere near as good.

Nowhere near as good as covering for his lack of legs and work rate. No midfielder in the league can cover as much ground as ndidi

Xhaka and Tilesman will be food for every team

 

[14Henry]

Nowhere near as good as covering for his lack of legs and work rate. No midfielder in the league can cover as much ground as ndidi

Xhaka and Tilesman will be food for every team

For someone who can play between Partey and Ødegaard who would you suggest. Teilimans of 12months ago would have been on our wishlist.

Now it seems people don't care for him. Bad season for Leicester but many good players have bad seasons. There's a player in Sancho and he was shocking this year. Who is the alternative?

 

[6gunner]

While I disagree with your conclusion, Cesc lite is good comparison. My view is that Tielemans isn't worth what it would have cost to have bought him a year ago, but if the figures circulating are real, he would improve our midfield a bit without breaking the bank.
Not a dream signing, but we haven't had anyone who could play through balls from a deeper position since peak Santi, and no-one doing it consistently since Cesc. That alone makes him a very interesting proposition

Your mention of through balls is interesting. One reason I think we would be better served with a right footer with an eye for a through ball as a left 8 is all the space in the center of the midfield.

When Partey hangs back our CB’s can get a little wider to support the fullbacks moving up the touch line. The space is in the center ( as Ødegaard plays closer to the opposite touch line). Unfortunately, with Xhaka being left footed (and not being a great dribbler) couldn’t really exploit it. But Tielemans will. And when he does, with the ball on his right foot, he’ll be in ideal position to play a through ball between the opponent’s fullback and center back for Martinelli/Jesus/Smith-Rowe to run onto. This would be similar to the pass that Thiago played to Jota for Liverpool’s first goal against us at the Emirates.

 

[yorch44]

Bissouma isn't a better pure footballer than Tielemans but I still think we need both profiles. I’m not a data aficionado but I’ve seen Bissouma boss midfields single handedly. His performance against Sp**s away was outstanding.

I’ve said numerous times I think the drop off from Partey to Elneny is far too big for us to cope with him being injured for a large period of time if we want top 4.

Some people might disagree but I think our physicality is truly dreadful. I see so many players lose their duels, get ran past and taken to their physical limits, which is what worries me with only bringing in Tielemans for our midfield choice.

The way we get around it is either Partey stays fit for the majority of the season (doubt it), Sambi goes up a level (hopefully) or because of our increased firepower/match winners we can score our way out of trouble in games.

We need Tielemans for the L8, he’s an upgrade there for sure but if Partey goes down I think we’re in trouble, which has been the case for two seasons now.

That's why I would go for Nkuku for that spot in a role of what De Bruyne does at city. He has the qualities Tielmans has but much better defensively and physically. I know Nkuku is being used as striker lately, but he was a midfielder before. He can play the b2b role like KdB does with that punch in the attack.

 

[yorch44]

Nowhere near as good as covering for his lack of legs and work rate. No midfielder in the league can cover as much ground as ndidi

Xhaka and Tilesman will be food for every team

That's why you can't play both of them...well you can't but you would have the slowest midfield in Europe as you said.

 

[Rasmi]

For someone who can play between Partey and Ødegaard who would you suggest. Teilimans of 12months ago would have been on our wishlist.

Now it seems people don't care for him. Bad season for Leicester but many good players have bad seasons. There's a player in Sancho and he was shocking this year. Who is the alternative?

Tilesman is the same player he was 12 months ago. We have xhaka, el neny and Ødegaard in midfield. 3 players who all lack athleticism and pace. He is just a bad fit to our current midfield. We have to increase our athleticism in midfield and can’t rely on Partey to be the only player with legs. I would much rather have zinchenko there

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

That's why I would go for Nkuku for that spot in a role of what De Bruyne does at city. He has the qualities Tielmans has but much better defensively and physically. I know Nkuku is being used as striker lately, but he was a midfielder before. He can play the b2b role like KdB does with that punch in the attack.

1. Nkunku wants to play in the front 3 and be the main man. He doesn't want to be a water carrier.

2. Nkunku wouldn't come here anyway, especially not when we're talking about playing him out of his current optimal position.

3. Bringing an attacking talent like Nkunku and playing him as an 8 is similar to when Juve played Thierry as wingback before Wenger made him our striker.

4. Imagine having 3 ****ters in our front 3, which is the current situation and playing Nkunku in a more withdrawn role

 

[yorch44]

1. Nkunku wants to play in the front 3 and be the main man. He doesn't want to be a water carrier.

2. Nkunku wouldn't come here anyway, especially not when we're talking about playing him out of his current optimal position.

3. Bringing an attacking talent like Nkunku and playing him as an 8 is similar to when Juve played Thierry as wingback before Wenger made him our striker.

4. Imagine having 3 ****ters in our front 3, which is the current situation and playing Nkunku in a more withdrawn role

Good to know you know Nkuku personally and have that good communication with him and enlight us with his personal thoughts.

Even more impressive is your knowledge about football, thanks to you I know since this moment that Kevin de Bruyne role is the "water carrier" role. I didn't know players like him or Iniesta or whatever midfielder have that job. You really understand football it seems. Maybe you should work as a manager, I see some resemblance to Arteta in your words!

 

[Barry]

That's why I would go for Nkuku for that spot in a role of what De Bruyne does at city. He has the qualities Tielmans has but much better defensively and physically.

Where is the evidence for this though? He's not been tested in the PL like Tielemans and his defensive numbers absolutely do not hold up against Tielemans.

He makes less than half of the tackles p90, he is terrible at tackling dribblers, same number of pressures and about half the number of blocks and interceptions. Some of this might be about role but honestly there is no evidence that Nkunku would do better than Tielemans in a deeper midfield role. He's an offensive player (a very good one).

 

[The_Playmaker]

Where is the evidence for this though? He's not been tested in the PL like Tielemans and his defensive numbers absolutely do not hold up against Tielemans.

He makes less than half of the tackles p90, he is terrible at tackling dribblers, same number of pressures and about half the number of blocks and interceptions. Some of this might be about role but honestly there is no evidence that Nkunku would do better than Tielemans in a deeper midfield role. He's an offensive player (a very good one).

Had this debate about Nkunku before. You say some of it might be role, but I think all of it is. You can't really compare a CFs defensive statistics to a central midfielders.

Nkunku played as a CM and DM in the PSG youth team. He broke in at right back in the senior team. He can handle himself defensively and has more recovery pace than Tielemans. He would be fine in the Premier League.

I don't think Tielemans will have a problem defensively either. It all stems from that one video of him blowing on a recovery run.

 

[Barry]

Had this debate about Nkunku before. You say some of it might be role, but I think all of it is. You can't really compare a CFs defensive statistics to a central midfielders.

Nkunku played as a CM and DM in the PSG youth team. He broke in at right back in the senior team. He can handle himself defensively and has more recovery pace than Tielemans. He would be fine in the Premier League.

I don't think Tielemans will have a problem defensively either. It all stems from that one video of him blowing on a recovery run.

Yeah, I've got no problem with this view but it's all theory. He *might* adapt and thrive in a deeper role - plenty of good players do. But if you take things on face value, now - Nkunku is performing at a high level in the offensive positions and posting really bad defensive numbers.

@yorch44 said that he was "much better defensively" - well the issue I have is that it's currently not the case. We are assuming that he changes league and keeps his performance level the same, that he adapts to a deeper role where he hasn't played (much) recently and that he more than doubles all of his key numbers to improve on Tielemans who is already doing all of that.

It just seems like a bit of an occam's razor to me. I'm not trying to have a go at anyone with this post either - I just think AM has talked down Tielemans so much that we are now looking at players who actually share his weaknesses and extrapolating that they would do a better job.

 

[RunTheTrap]

Tielemans looks more like a very poor version of what Cesc was as our main CM, than Santi, in terms of style.

Really hope this doesn't happen, think it will be a terrible signing.

Why?

 

[Riou]

Why?

Mainly because I will never forgive the tubby ****er, for his role in Sp**s last minute win over Leicester.

Tielemans was a disgrace that match, tbh...and I am a petty, petty man.

 

[yorch44]

Yeah, I've got no problem with this view but it's all theory. He *might* adapt and thrive in a deeper role - plenty of good players do. But if you take things on face value, now - Nkunku is performing at a high level in the offensive positions and posting really bad defensive numbers.

@yorch44 said that he was "much better defensively" - well the issue I have is that it's currently not the case. We are assuming that he changes league and keeps his performance level the same, that he adapts to a deeper role where he hasn't played (much) recently and that he more than doubles all of his key numbers to improve on Tielemans who is already doing all of that.

It just seems like a bit of an occam's razor to me. I'm not trying to have a go at anyone with this post either - I just think AM has talked down Tielemans so much that we are now looking at players who actually share his weaknesses and extrapolating that they would do a better job.

I didn't mean much better in a way he is going to be like Partey, munbad for using those words. Only he has more pace and physical presence so I am assuming he can cover more ground. What are stats in defense for KdB? To make it easier, when I see Nkuku playing I can see a very very creative player, and most of his goals are runs from behind. Mostly he five assists and plays like a creative winger. Actually KdB played on the wings at the beginning of his career and as pure cam. It was Pep who used him as Mezzala and asked him to cover more ground and defend more. Problem is a lote of of posters here are using numbers instead of roles to refer to players duties. There is a lot of roles a CM can do. A maestro has a different role of what a B2B or a Mezzala offer.

I see Nkuku as player so well rounded physically and technically to play as Mezzala, he wouldn't be the best st defender but has the engine to cover the ground, then offensively he has the vision to make those through balls we all love and the dribbling to take the ball and dig himself into defenders with and take a good shot or do what Ramsey did, goals running from outside the box.

But here is the other possibility, play him on the front and he is much better than Gabriel Jesús. Why are not going for him or at least trying? We offered big money for Vlahovic, offer that for him. And you have a player who is capable of playing all the 3 front and even the midfield.

 

[Barry]

But here is the other possibility, play him on the front and he is much better than Gabriel Jesús. Why are not going for him or at least trying? We offered big money for Vlahovic, offer that for him. And you have a player who is capable of playing all the 3 front and even the midfield.

Yeah fair points. I think it's much more sensible to talk about Nkunku as a Jesus alternative where you are utilising his known strengths.

Between the two I'd still marginally favour Jesus because of his league experience but there's not much in it and either would be pretty great.

 

[lomekian]

Had this debate about Nkunku before. You say some of it might be role, but I think all of it is. You can't really compare a CFs defensive statistics to a central midfielders.

Nkunku played as a CM and DM in the PSG youth team. He broke in at right back in the senior team. He can handle himself defensively and has more recovery pace than Tielemans. He would be fine in the Premier League.

I don't think Tielemans will have a problem defensively either. It all stems from that one video of him blowing on a recovery run.

Nknunku aint coming here and if he does he'll cost 60m +